Religion

Whickwithy · Post edited by Whickwithy at 2020-12-03 09:13:40

There are a few things that really annoyed me about the brouhaha that happened some time ago regarding religion.

First of all, someone attacking a forum member for their religious beliefs seems like a perfect time for moderation. All our moderator seems to do is come up with offensive names for categories. Maybe that's all he is allowed to do. Who knows?

More importantly, though, is the idea that was conveyed that religion is the source of all of our troubles. It is a matter of focusing on surface issues - as if they matter. Humanity is really good at doing this.

I was just reviewing all of the obvious sources of trouble that humanity concocts from money to religion to government to economic theories to cultures to fake news and not a single one of them makes a damned bit of difference. They are all the same nonsense under separate cover.

The thing that got me going is democracy. The western powers have done their best to overturn any government that is not a democracy. Just like religion, they try to force the issue.

The problem isn't with any of these sources of trouble. The problem is with humanity's willingness to confuse the issue. One real problem is continuing to think that the obvious sources of trouble are the real problem. The real problem has to do with humanity constantly deluding itself. We have so deluded ourselves that we accept the concept that humanity is broken. That is so wrong. The human condition is broken, not humanity itself.

I'm not sure why I bothered to post this here. Feeling disgruntled, feeling annoyed... feeling rather humanoid

Whickwithy

Okay, that's weird, so let's try it again. As Joni would say, "the lines are open". For a few hours, anyways.

whispered

Well, I guess some people think religion is the root of much, or even all, trouble in the world. Others might think it's the solution. Some think the economic system is the problem, others patriarchy and so on. Forgive me if I recall it wrongly, but isn't your view that male sexual performance is the central problem?

It's frustrating when other people don't see the world as we do, but isn't that how we learn - by listening to those other points of view?

As a PS on democracy, I've recently been enjoying the late David Graeber's work. As he points out, the Western model of "democracy" is really the ancient world's aristocratic system of government. In the US, it's been developed to a reductio ad absurdam, where the citizenry get to decide which of the two most corrupt men in the country gets to be Head of State, and legislation and policy is, quite literally, bought by lobby groups. The main reason Western countries don't feature high in international indices of corruption is that they have legalised practices that elsewhere are labelled corrupt (eg in Nigeria, you have to surreptiously hand over a wodge of notes to a petty official to get a passport quickly. In Western countries, you hand the same money over, for the same result, but its called a 'fee' for 'expedited issue'.)

Low

In my humble opinion the root of all trouble in the modern world is Twitter. It sounds like I'm joking but I am absolutely serious. It's a toxic life form.

Whickwithy · Post edited by Whickwithy at 2020-12-05 11:36:09

We deal with nothing other than surface issues. Sorry to pick on you, Low, but twitter is a perfect example. Is it really a toxic lifeform or is it the people on it that create a toxic environment? Religions, governments, economic policies, technology all fall into the same category. We split humanity into little groups of ideologies as if they make some real difference in anything. The problem is humanity itself, not any of the superfluous, idiotic stances that humanity takes regarding any issue. And, yes, you are right, Whispered, I am certain that humanity's failure to become fully human, fully sentient, is due to the one thing that humanity never got right as a sentient race: sex. For more than three thousand years, we have had concepts like honour, integrity, dignity, responsibility, love, etc that we have never been able to fully attain. Try as hard we we like, we can never become fully human. Our sentience senses what these characteristics are supposed to be but, somehow, we have never been able to fully attain them. In fact, even the thought of such concepts has deteriorated over the ages. All because guys can't keep it up long enough to learn to love. The crucial ties between sex and love have never been fully understood. Love, a human, sentient concept is completely dependent on humanity understanding those ties.

Anyways, I've posted one of the books online for now for a more in-depth look at what is missing. I've had feedback that I have not addressed other sexual orientations. I did cover this in Beauty & Fiction. To summarize, heterosexual intercourse is broken - for a sentient race. Heterosexual intercourse should be more than rutting - for a sentient race. Until we thoroughly understand what is broken, the reason and purpose of any other sexual orientation cannot be fully comprehended.

https://sentienceww.blogspot.com/2020/12/a-sentient-perspective.html

Let me just add that any man can last as long as he pleases. The historical reasons for humanity never discovering this is one of the most fascinating conundrums of our predicament.

Urban_Tribesman · Post edited by Urban_Tribesman at 2020-12-05 11:41:55

Personally, I am not religious, despite being born into a Christian family, being baptised & going to Sunday School as a 10 year old for 2 years, I still have a New Testament in my library with my name in it that I was given having attained a certain degree of ‘learning’, so it can’t be said that my position is one of ignorance. I have no problem with others believing in a divine creation (which probably makes me Agnostic, not Atheist) it’s just not for me. Too much pain, inequality & suffering in the world for me to accept an omnipotent, all knowing being looking down on us. I do, however, believe in a creative force; call it nature if you will & strangely, (maybe I’m Pagan) but I also believe the message of Christianity is the right one, and that there should be peace, love & harmony with my fellow Man, it’s just that, he doesn’t seem to have got the memo, & there is only so much cheek turning you can do before you think, “hold on, somethings wrong with this scenario”!

I like Christmas, have a Nativity set (which I adulterate with additional figures) & have enjoyed other religions festivals when the opportunity has presented itself. I’ve been in Buddhist temples, Hindu, Muslim, I love the feeling of sanctity inside Churches of all denominations it’s just that some of the followers of religion become very factional & intolerant of other beliefs, despite all purporting to be about peace, & that seems stupid & just turns me off.

If you are religious & someone of faith, respect others in their choice of belief, or even not to believe at all.

(I stole that last bit from a speech from G’Kar in the Sci Fi epic Babylon 5. Who said Sci Fi can’t teach you anything!)

Urban_Tribesman

If you are interested, this is G’Kar’s whole speech. It was given at the inception of the new interplanetary alliance.

“It is the inalienable right of every sentient being, to live free, to pursue their dreams, to address wrongs within their own society, without fear of retribution, to believe as their conscious requires in matters of faith, but also to respect the rights of others to believe differently, or not at all.

We must reach a point where the nobility of intellect asserts itself and says no.

We need not be afraid of those that are different. We can embrace that difference and learn from it.”

Whickwithy

Hmmm, the more I consider twitter, the more I realize it is just one more symptom of what is really wrong. Any time people are allowed to be anonymous, the animal comes out in full regalia. I think, maybe, the first instance of it was road-rage. We need to become human. We need to put the animal away for good. There's only on way.

Whickwithy · Post edited by Whickwithy at 2020-12-07 07:46:32

Urban_Tribesman said:
Personally, blah, blah, blah

Then, why is it that you attacked Serenity's religious beliefs? Is it only because she ignored your self-abrogating flirtatious advances or was it something else? And, then Iuventus piles on for no rational reason. Of course, rational is not a big part of the current human condition but still...

Urban_Tribesman

Seriously, you are back on that?

There were no ‘flirtatious’ advances from me towards her, self abrogating or otherwise. To start with, she’s about 30 years my junior.

I’m not religious, despite being exposed to it to some depth as a child. Can’t help that but happy for others to believe if it really helps them or if they just need it as a crutch.

What part of ‘ but also to respect the rights of others to believe differently, or not at all’ failed to be understood?

And here was I thinking we were doing all right & moved on.

Merry Christmas man; sounds like you need one.

Urban_Tribesman

By the way, the ‘Moderator’ you had a side swipe at in the beginning of this thread?

He’s a self confessed Atheist if I remember correctly but have a dig at everybody if you must. We’ve all got very broad shoulders.

iuventus

@Urban_Tribesman Remember it's been a tough year emotionally for everyone. Blessed be!

Low · Post edited by Low at 2020-12-08 06:39:01

Whickwithy said:
We deal with nothing other than surface issues. Sorry to pick on you, Low, but twitter is a perfect example. Is it really a toxic lifeform or is it the people on it that create a toxic environment? Religions, governments, economic policies, technology all fall into the same category. We split humanity into little groups of ideologies as if they make some real difference in anything. The problem is humanity itself, not any of the superfluous, idiotic stances that humanity takes regarding any issue.

You don't need to apologise as you didn't pick on me, rather you basically elaborated on my point without me having to. Cheers :-*

Whickwithy · Post edited by Whickwithy at 2020-12-09 08:58:47

Urban_Tribesman said:
Can’t help that but happy for others to believe if it really helps them or if they just need it as a crutch.

I'll just stick to the one question.

Why did you and Iuventus attack Serenity's religious beliefs?

Whickwithy · Post edited by Whickwithy at 2020-12-09 09:45:06

You're right, IUV. I've been being snarky. Sorry to all about that. It's just that I miss the interaction with Serenity. It was such a shame that she was essentially driven off of this board and I would still like to know why.

Urban_Tribesman · Post edited by Urban_Tribesman at 2020-12-09 10:07:36

Whickwithy said:

Urban_Tribesman said:

I'll just stick to the one question.

Why did you and Iuventus attack Serenity's religious beliefs?

I’m not aware I did except to state that I do not have any myself. This board keeps a record of everything posted (trust me) so please dig it out & I will try to justify anything said.

Where I did have a pop at Serenity, & I saw this only yesterday when I was plowing a few old threads, was where she kept attacking Alison for her views, which I thought was a bit much on a fan site mostly dedicated to the Lady in question. I think I said “if you don’t like it (Alison’s views) no one is keeping you here & you know where the door is”

I still think that was fair advice.

Howdy, Stranger!

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